Conversation with Cyrus, a WMSCOG member

In my previous post regarding clues that the World Mission Society Church of God is false, one of those commenting was "Cyrus."  Cyrus is currently a member of the WMSCOG and is willing to engage in conversation to clarify some points.  Thank you, Cyrus!

Our conversation will take place right here, through the comment section of this post.  I hope it will serve as a good source of information for the rest of our readers here.  However, I respectfully request that the comments on this post be limited to just Cyrus.  For anyone else who wishes to comment about this conversation, please visit the forum (examiningthewmscog.com/forum), or send me an email.  Thank you!

First, some ground rules, Cyrus, for you and me:

• Each comment should be made in two parts, a response to the previous point and the raising of a question.
• Response -- We should respond to the question that was last put forth, keeping in mind the purpose of explaining and encouraging understanding and not simply fighting.  Also, please avoid using phrases such as "You don't understand because you are not one of God's chosen" (more examples here).  We can also respond to the previous response, as long as it doesn't include an additional question that needs an answer.
• Question -- We should ask a question, either to further pursue the issue, or raise a different point.  For the ease of following the conversation, please limit the question to one point.  Do not ask a question related to your response and ask a new question as well.
• If we think the other's response is incomplete, inadequate, or needs to be clarified, first we should answer their question (give our response), then our question should concern the previous response.  In other words, don't avoid their question in order to focus on their response.  In this way, we should never be talking about more than two topics at once.
• Timeliness is nice, but life is busy.  A delay in answering should not be taken negatively or cause concern, unless there has been silence for more than two weeks.

I hope that is all clear.  Thank you, again, and now let's get started.  You posed the first question...

---

"Let us make man in our image... Male and female He created them" Genesis 1:26-27. "the Spirit and the bride say come... Take the free gift of the water of life." Revelation 22. The bride of christ is His bride. Guests are invited to the wedding supper, not the bride. We are the guests. Right?

My response:
The first part of what you wrote (Gen. 1:26-27) is about the word Elohim.  I have written about that here: Part 1, Part 2, and Part 3.  I'm going to focus on your question about Revelation 22.  I understand your question to be, "We are the guests at the wedding supper.  Therefore, doesn't someone else have to be the bride of Christ?"

I have heard the WMSCOG say that the Church cannot be both the bride and the guests at the wedding.  But please consider this...

God is called the father of the Israelites, but God is also called the husband of Israel.  But how can the Israelites be both the children and the wife of God?  It doesn't make sense, does it?

It does when you consider that individually, the people were counted as God's children.  But corporately, together as the nation, they were considered as God's bride

In the same way, individually, we are each invited to become part of the Church, the body of believers.  But corporately, together as the Church body, we are the bride of Christ.

God uses descriptive language to help us understand our relationship with Him.

I hope you are able to understand that this is a valid, alternate interpretation of the same verses.

My question for you:
The WMSCOG teaches that there are two distinct Gods.  How do you reconcile that with verses such as these which declare there is only one God?  (Note that all of these quotes use the singular word for God.)
"For I am God, and there is no other" (Isaiah 45:22 and 46:9)
"Is there a God besides me?  Indeed, there is no other rock; I know not one." (Isaiah 44:8)
"Before Me there was no God formed; nor shall there be after Me." (Isaiah 43:10)
"Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God," (1 Timothy 1:17)

Ok, your turn.  Please remember the two parts, response and question.

Proof that the World Mission Society Church of God is False

I wrote previously asking World Mission Society Church of God members to share objective proof that their faith is true.  So far, no one has had any objective proof to offer.

Today, I'm turning the idea around to disproof.  What objective information do we have that proves the WMSCOG to be false?

I want to emphasize the word objective.  We're looking for provable facts here, not feelings, opinions and matters of interpretation.  (Click here for an example of why we can't just go by feelings.)

I love analogies.  It really helps me to understand something if I can see how it relates to or corresponds with something else.  Here's an analogy for you...

A popular movie these days at my house is Disney's "Tangled," the story of Rapunzel.  What I really find interesting as I watch it is the relationship between Rapunzel and Mother Gothel.  It follows so closely with the BITE model of destructive mind control.  As viewers, we can see how Mother Gothel manipulates Rapunzel in the relationship, but Rapunzel just sees it as love and care from her 'mother.'

In reality, Mother Gothel is not her mother at all and is using her for selfish means.  There's one moment, closer to the end of the movie, when Rapunzel finally realizes the truth.  One clue leads to everything unraveling.  What is that one clue?  Rapunzel and the lost princess share the same birthday.  Rapunzel combines that clue with everything else she saw when she escaped isolation (the symbol of the kingdom, the picture of the little princess), and the truth is revealed!

Now back to the WMSCOG.  If none of the other common reasons convince you, then please follow these clues, provable facts, to show you where the so-called 'truth' of the WMSCOG starts unraveling.  Thankfully there are many clues to find, not just one, and I'll list some for you here.

These are all matters of fact and logic and cannot be debated.  (1+1 = 2; can you debate that it doesn't?)  Well, if you'd like to try to debate these facts, go ahead, and I look forward to hearing from you about it.

The WMSCOG teaches that God lies

What do you call a 'God' who acts contrary to the nature of God?  A false god.  (Click here for more information.)

Isaac -- The WMSCOG teaches that Abraham's son Isaac was God in the flesh.  However, Isaac lied (Genesis 26).  God does NOT lie (Titus 1:2).

Ahnsahnghong's own book -- In the book "Problems with New Jerusalem, the Bride, and Women's Veils," Ahnsahnghong said that there was NO 'Mother God' and and specifically argued against the same verses the WMSCOG used today to try to prove there is.  The WMSCOG's position is that Ahnsahnghong wrote the book to prevent his followers from believing in the wrong woman as 'Mother God,' and then withdrew the book so he could reveal the right woman.  There are only two conclusions I can draw from this, neither of which is good for the WMSCOG.  Either:

Ahnsahnghong told the truth in his book, and there is no 'Mother God' (which disproves the WMSCOG) or...
Ahnsahnghong lied in his book, which proves he cannot be God (which also disproves the WMSCOG).

The WMSCOG uses false historical facts

I have been told that these are not actually false facts, but simplifications to avoid lengthy discussions of complicated history.  I understand the need to simplify, but even simplifications can (and should) be accurate.  Build doctrine on false simplifications, and you end up with false doctrine.

The 10 Kingdoms -- As part of the Pope-is-Antichrist doctrine, the WMSCOG teaches that the Roman Empire broke up into 10 countries, 3 of which were destroyed by the Catholic Church by 538.  The supposed 10 kingdoms are not accurate, 5 (not 3) were destroyed, and the kingdoms' religious faith was not a consistent factor.  (Click here and here for more information.)

The year 538 -- Again as part of the Pope-is-Antichrist doctrine, the WMSCOG teaches that the last of the three kingdoms to fall was the Ostrogoths, destroyed in AD 538, which began the prophesied 1260 years of the 'Dark Ages.'  However, the Ostrogoths were destroyed must later than 538, and there is no significance of the year 538 in Papal history either.  (Click here and here for more information.)

The WMSCOG has kept the Feasts incorrectly 
(even according to their own regulations!)

This is an obvious clue for me!  If you are uncertain or confused about it, please click on the link provided for more details.

The Feasts of the seventh month -- According to the WMSCOG, keeping the Feasts of God properly is absolutely essential to your salvation.  The Feast of Trumpets, Day of Atonement, and Feast of Tabernacles must take place on the specified days in the seventh month of the 'sacred calendar.'

But if you examine what has actually been done at the WMSCOG, you'll find that in 2005, 2008, and 2010, the seventh month Feasts were kept in the eighth month.  (Click here for the detailed chart.)  The only word I can think of to describe that is incompetence, and that is definitely not a word to describe God (or a church that claims to be lead by a God-in-the-flesh).

If you are a WMSCOG member, I pray that you will follow these clues to find true freedom in the real Jesus Christ.

Christmas -- Responding to WMSCOG comments

I'm back again, still trying to catch up with the many comments posted recently by World Mission Society Church of God members.  Just a reminder, if you would like to have a conversation, you are welcome to email me directly (knowhispeace@gmail.com) or join the forum here.

I have not changed or removed anything in these comments.

On July 31 at 10:40 pm, Anonymous posted on "Mother God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments" in response to my comment --

Genny wrote: Hi again. I assume you are the same person who wrote to ask if I celebrate Christmas and Easter. I think I did not make myself clear. I said nothing about December 25 because that date itself has minimal significance to me. I know full well (as should all Christians) that we do not know the exact date of Jesus' birth.

Anonymous wrote: Genny, so you acknowledged that Dec 25 is not the birthday of Jesus Christ then, and you are making yourself clear that this date has a minimal significance to you, meaning there is still a remaining significance to you so as to say.  

Yes, there is still a remaining significance to me.  If you were going to choose a time of year to celebrate the birth of Jesus, the time of the winter solstice would be meaningful.  The nights get longer and longer, and just when you might lose hope that darkness will win, the season turns.  Daytime begins to lengthen again.  The light triumphs, if you will.

Jesus is the light of the world, and He has triumphed over darkness -- John 8:12 and 12:46; Matthew 4:16.

This was not from a WMSCOG member, but it fits right in with this topic...

On August 6 at 10:47 am, James posted on "Mother God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments" --

The sad thing in all of this is that there is absolutely NO evidence, historically speaking, that December 25 was a pagan holiday before it was a Christian one. This is a bit of sloppy scholarship and old wives tales conflated over the generations.

At most, the Romans had two sun cults. The original, dating back to the centuries before Christ, Sol Indiges, had a feast on December 11 - NOT December 25. The other sun cult was the cult of Sol Invictus, which was actually the importation of Syrian Mythraism into Roman society by the Emperor Aurelian in the late third century AD. December 25 has never been specifically identified as a holiday for Sol Invictus, and the earliest records of a late December celebration of Sol Invictus are no older than the fourth century AD (mid 300's).

So, there's no evidence that there was a holiday for the sun in late December until long after Christ.

What we do have in some evidence, however, is that some Christian groups were celebrating the Nativity in the early to mid-200's. What we also have is the simple reality that December 25 was calculated by the early church by adding 9 months to March 25 - the Annunciation. And March 25 is calculated from Luke's statement in the first chapter of his Gospel that Gabriel came to Mary in "the sixth month" - which in the calendar he most likely observed introduced by Alexander the Great, translates to late March to early April by our Gregorian calendar.

None of this is to say that December 25 is exactly right. It could be off by days, weeks, or months. What's important is that there is no evidence from antiquity that the early church derived its holidays from the pagan calendar.  

Thanks, James.  That was really interesting.  Here is another comment about Christmas...

On July 31 at 10:48 pm, Anonymous posted on "Mother God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments" --

Genny wrote: I happily remember the birth of Jesus all year long. Yes, I sing Christmas hymns with my children even in the summer. I especially celebrate Jesus' birth in December because that's when the world puts a focus on it, and it's especially nice to celebrate in unison.

Anonymous wrote: On this, you clearly remember the birth of Jesus by singing Christmas songs and you believe that celebrating the birth of Jesus with everybody in the whole world because this is the day when the whole world puts their focus on it and it is very nice to celebrate in unison with them. Although you do not know what day is the birthday of Jesus, you simply mean that you can celebrate the birthday of Jesus any day of the year as you want to. So ,do you also mean you can celebrate the birthday of Jesus Christ many times a year as you want too? 

 and (a few minutes later at 10:52 pm) --

Genny wrote: As for the day, though, if you are talking about specific gatherings such as with my family or church, I can honestly say that I celebrate at least 5 or 6 different days. You see, it is the reason for the celebration, not the date of Dec. 25, that is important to me.

Anonymous wrote: So, you acknowledged that you celebrate the birthday of Jesus even 5 or 6x in different days because it is not the date that is important to you but the reason for the celebration. You also know very well that you follow your own thoughts in doing this! 

You believe that it is wrong to celebrate Jesus birth on a date that is not His actual birthday, and that we shouldn't just choose any date.  You also believe it is wrong of me to celebrate Jesus birth on many different days.  Do I understand your objections correctly?

Reflect on this... do you have children?  When do you celebrate their birthdays?  How about the rest of the people in your family?  How about your own birthday?  Do you ever celebrate on a day that is not the actual birthday?

Among my family and friends, we often have birthday celebrations that do not fall on the actual birthday of the person being honored.  This year, my son celebrated his birthday on three different days -- once with friends, and twice with two different parts of the family.  Are you saying that is wrong?  If I can't celebrate my child's birthday with family and friends on his actual birthday, am I prohibited from choosing a different day for us to celebrate in unison?  Would you like to give me a verse from the Bible that forbids my doing this?

I happily remember my children's birthdays all year round too, because I am so thankful to have them a part of my life.  I will gladly tell them stories about their births any time they ask, without making them wait until their actual birthday.  When I hear a particular song or see a particular picture or just have a passing thought about their births, I will praise God once again for the blessings He gave me.  I won't put the thoughts aside simply because it's "not the right day."  It is the same when I think about the birth of Jesus.  You would say this is wrong?

On July 31 at 11:42 pm, Anonymous posted on "Mother God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments" --

Genny, Is this too much for you answer? I understand how you feel! But I will listen to what you say and make a beneficial decision out of it. When you are ready to post all of my comments!! 

No, it's not too much for me to answer.  I'm just limited on time, and working through all the comments as I am able.  If you would put a name on your comments, it would make it easier to know which are yours, and which are from someone else.  You don't have to leave an email address with your name, and I don't mind if you choose a pseudonym.

I hope you'll be back.  There are still many more comments to go.

The Power of God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments

I'm here today to address  a couple more of the comments from World Mission Society Church of God member(s) that have come through in the last several days.  Again, I'll copy the comments exactly as they were written, without adding, removing, or editing anything

On July 28 at 5:55 am, Anonymous posted on "Mother God -- Responding to WMSCOG comments" --

You quoted: ROM 6:9 - Christ cannot die again. Ahnsahnghong is dead.
Who is Christ to you? Isn't He God Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth? In the first place, does God need the flesh to wear? What is the flesh to God. God has no limitations. He can do whatever God wants to do. The flesh, he used in the body of Jesus Christ God does not need. But He used it during His 1st Coming because God CAN. It does not mean that He cannot use any other flesh, it is because GOD CAN!I believe you do not understand the POWER of GOD> 

 On July 29 at 6:34 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus," in response to bigcedbeatz's comment --

Bigcedbiatz, You are foolish because of your little faith. Does God needs the flesh? NO!! When God made the heavens and the earth, He was in Spirit. He needs no flesh at all. But it does not mean that he will not use the flesh for his purpose. Do you know why? It is because God CAN! If God plans it, He will do it, and He CAN!!The flesh He used in the body of Jesus Christ is only a flesh. He used it for His purpose and left it. Will God forever use that same flesh again? God will do whatever He plans to do and nobody can stop God in fulfilling HIS plan! If He wants to reveal himself again in the flesh as an American, Russian, African, HE can do it because HE CAN!!!! Why do you question the power of GOD????? Foolish Christian!! 

Your basic point seems to be that it is within God's power to appear (be born) in the flesh again if He wanted to, and in any physical appearance.  You think I do not understand or believe in the power of God to do such a thing.

Yes, I do believe in the great power of God.  I believe He is able to do things that I can't even imagine.  But there are somethings that God will NOT do -- He will not do anything that is contrary to His character, His nature.  He will not lie.  He will not be unjust.  He will not contradict Himself.  (Here is a more detailed summary of what God cannot do.)

God said that He would not die again (Romans 6:9).  God said, multiple times, that there is only one God (see those verses here, here, and here.)  Did God lie when He said those things?

The WMSCOG teaches that Isaac was also God in the flesh.  Yet Isaac lied (Genesis 26), and Isaac was deceived (Genesis 27).

The Bible says God will not lie (Titus 1:2), and that He cannot be deceived by anyone (Hebrews 4:13).  The WMSCOG teaches that God lies and can be deceived.

Are you saying that God is so "powerful" that He can act contrary to His nature?

What do you call a "God" who acts contrary to God's unchanging nature?  A false god!

Accusations -- Responding to WMSCOG comments

I have received quite a few comments from World Mission Society Church of God member(s) in the last few days.  Rather than trying to address them all in the comment section, I'm going to post them here.  I'd also like to remind everyone about the forum where you can discuss WMCSOG topics.

I'll copy the comments exactly as they were written, without adding, removing, or editing anything.  However, they will not necessarily be in the order received...

On July 29 at 6:39 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus" --

Genny, you are not posting all comments on your blog!!! These means that you are a false prophet who testifies falsehood. You do not want your evil schemes to be exposed so people will believe your lies!!! 

No, I do not post all comments on my blog.  You might be surprised at the magnitude of rudeness (to put it nicely), that occasionally comes through (both from pro- and anti-WMSCOG commentors).  I also won't post any comments that reveal personally identifying information.  Also, some comments are picked up by the spam filter.

Another thing to think about, I have a full life outside of this blog, my own family and job and activities, so sometimes I am delayed at approving comments and responding to them.  Please be patient with me.

Now, if you are serious that my "not posting all comments" is evidence that I'm a "false prophet" and that I don't want my "evil schemes to be exposed," then what would you say about all of the WMSCOG sites and member blogs that do not post all comments?

On July 29 at 5:54 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus" --

The secrets of the knowledge of the kingdom of heaven has been given to God's children but not to people who are not God's children that is why Ahnsahnghong's books are not available to the general public. 

That's not a very useful quote to argue with.  Anyone could say, "I am God's child and you are not.  That's why you don't understand the truth I'm telling you."  You need something more substantial than that.

If Ahnsahnghong's books truly held the truth, and the WMSCOG truly preached the truth, why wouldn't they want the truth available to everyone? 

Think about other organizations that restrict their publications in the way the WMSCOG does.  What kinds of organizations are they?  Why do they have those restrictions?  (If you can't answer those questions for yourself, let me know.)

On July 29 at 6:44 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus," in response to Carlos' comment --

Carlos, this website did not open your eyes but it closed your eyes to the truth! Genny does not follow the teachings of the bible absolutely and she encourage people to worship God in their own ways. That is absolutely WRONG. It is because Salvation belongs to God. And His statutes we need to keep. You are being deceived!!!  

We can each call the other "deceived!" but the word means little if it's not backed up by evidence.  Please check out my three summary pages (Key Verses, Internal Evidence, and Mistakes).  Also, if you haven't read the Start Here page, please do.

When you say that I "encourage people to worship God in their own ways," what do you mean by that?  What I think of when I hear that is that people should worship according to the personality that God gave them, and what is meaningful to them, in a way that pleases God.  For example, someone who loves nature probably worships God better when they are camping or on a hike and should not think that a building is the only suitable place to worship God.

On July 29 at 6:24 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus," in response to Daniyyel's comment --

Danniyel, your sister is the one who is so sorry for you because your poor soul is dying. You believe that she is in a cult but in reality, you are the one who is in a cult. Let me explain this. The Jews captured apostle Paul and beheaded him because Paul was charged of heresy leading the Nazarene sect(cult). In the eyes of the general public who claim to believe in God persecuted the true believers: Paul, Peter, Stephen, the disciples. People like you also believe in God right? But you are the one persecuting the true believers in God, you even call them being in a cult! Someone who is in a cult does not follow the teachings of the bible. Let me ask you this. Do you celebrate Christmas? Are you a Sunday worshipper? If you are, then you are not following the teachings of the bible because the bible does not teach people to worship God on Sundays and also, nowhere in the bible Dec 25 is the birthday of Christ. You are being deceived by satan's schemes. 

And, on July 29 at 6:11 pm, Anonymous posted on "The name of Jesus" --

What is heresy? How do we know that a church is heretical? In the bible, heresy is a practice that does not follow the doctrine of the bible. Then which church is heretical? Sunday keeping churches or Saturday keeping churches? In the bible, God commanded people to keep the Sabbath day holy, which is Saturday. There is a Sabbath in accordance with the law of Moses and there is a Sabbath in accordance with the law of Christ. Since Christ gave us examples to follow even after his baptism, He kept the Sabbath day as his custom which is on Saturday. He said he is the Lord of the Sabbath. Obviously, Sunday is not the day Jesus gave, as an example to follow. Then, which church does not follow the example of Jesus Christ? Sunday keepers or Saturday keepers? The Sunday keeping churches are obviously heretical because they do not follow the examples of Christ and his disciples. Who introduced Sunday worship then? If it did not come from God, then it must come from the enemy of God which is the devil who uses all religious leaders, priests ,pastors, government officials, etc in his evil schemes to lead the whole world astray. 

It is true that when you have two people with opposing stands, each will say that they themselves have the truth and that the other is the one who is wrong.  That is why it's so important for both to set aside any preconceived notions, distinguish fact from opinion, and look at the issue from a rational standpoint.

No one likes to be told they are in a cult.  It could be true, or it could be a misunderstanding.  Since it is a word used by professionals to describe the World Mission Society Church of God, it is worth investigating.  (As a side note, one of the organizations I have a good opinion of is also on the list of cults at the Freedom of Mind resource center.  Is it true or a misunderstanding or what?  If I were considering joining, it would be worth investigating.)

Let me ask you this.  Do you celebrate birthdays, anniversaries, New Year on January 1, Independence Day (July 4), Mother's Day, Father's Day, etc.  Where does the Bible teach you to celebrate those days?

The Bible does have something to say about Sunday.  Here is a place you can go for resources about Sunday and the Sabbath. 

Sunday meetings were introduced by the apostles, who remembered Jesus' resurrection every time a Sunday came around.  If you don't like that, then perhaps you should tell God that He should have picked a different day for the Resurrection so the apostles wouldn't have use the "Day of the Sun."  Maybe He should have worked it all out for a Monday?  Oh, no, then you would probably accuse Christians of "Moon worship" for meeting on Mondays...

That's all I have time for right now.  It's been a very busy summer for me, but I have lots to write about and more comments to address, so I hope to get back here again soon.

Evidence for your faith -- A question for WMSCOG members

I don't believe in a completely blind faith.  I know that some people are perfectly happy believing in their religious faith without knowing anything substantial as evidence, and ignoring anything that has a risk of disproving their faith.  That is not in my personality, though.

I have talked with atheists, agnostics, and others who question my faith in Christianity.  Some have said, "How can you believe in Jesus and the Bible when there are inconsistencies, contradictions, and other problems?"

I understand this question.  And so I can also understand the reluctance of World Mission Society Church of God members (and people of other religions) to abandon their faith when they are confronted with problems.

Several things happen when I am confronted with those problems, and I am sure there is a similarity between me and my sister (and other WMSCOG members).  I see that:

1. Some of those 'contradictions' others see really do have logical explanations for them if you just look a little farther.
2. People do sometimes fail to act in a 'Christian' manner, but that is because we are flawed human beings.  We need to look at the teaching of the faith more than the actions of the adherents.
3. Some of those other philosophical problems really do have answers if you will just consider another viewpoint.
4. For the cases that are left over, if there are no explanations or answers, I understand the objection, but it does not bother me enough to abandon my faith.  Why?  Because I trust God enough that He has an answer even if I can't see it.

I'd like to focus on point 4.  In order to trust your faith in God enough to overcome any apparent objections, there MUST be something at the root of it as evidence, proof to build your faith on.-- something solid, like the house built on the rock (Matthew 7:25).

When I am confronted with the toughest questions about what I believe, I have to go back to that root, that rock, and remember the immovable facts my faith is built on.

The evidence can't be something that's a matter of opinion or interpretation--those are not stable or provable.

It can't be something that is entirely within the belief system, because then you get into circular arguments which don't prove anything.  Basically that would be, "Why do you believe in the Bible?  Because it is God's word.  How do you know it is God's word?  Because it tells me so."

No, it needs to be something from the outside that is factually based.

Here are two of the key pieces of evidence of my faith in Jesus and Christianity:

• Support for the Resurrection is profound.  It is the only logical explanation (as strange as it may be) of the events occurring after the Resurrection and the changed lives of the disciples.
• There is an abundance of fulfilled prophecy in the Bible recorded in historical documents. 

Now the question for WMSCOG members... What do you consider evidence for your faith in Ahn Sahng Hong and Zahng Gil Jah and the doctrine of the WMSCOG?  When the WMSCOG tells you that you can't have a faith based on common sense, what evidence do you rely on to know you can trust them?

Remember, this evidence needs to be something outside the WMSCOG that is factual, verifiable.

For example, do not say your evidence is the prophecies that Ahn Sahng Hong fulfilled as the second coming Christ, because that is based on the WMSCOG's own interpretation of those prophecies.

Ok, responses please. :)

Easter -- The WMSCOG's misunderstandings

It's Easter.  A blessed Resurrection Day to you all!

The World Mission Society Church of God's general pastor Kim Joo-Cheol has shared this about the WMSCOG's view of Christian Easter celebrations:

Most Christians celebrate Easter by eating boiled eggs on the first Sunday after the full moon following the vernal equinox. Actually, however, it originated from the pagan custom of serving Easter (Ashtoreth)—the pagan goddess who was associated with the spring sun. Easter is fundamentally different from the Resurrection Day Jesus established. (source)

The WMSCOG has some serious misunderstandings regarding Easter (Resurrection Day).

First, eating boiled eggs on Resurrection Day has nothing to do with serving a pagan goddess.  It has to do with Lent.  Traditionally, during the time of Lent, the people would fast, and among the foods they would not eat were eggs.  What do you do when your chickens keep producing eggs but you are not allowed to eat them?  Do you let them go to waste?  No, you boil them, and keep them until you may eat them again.  [see comments for correction] When is the fasting of Lent over, and when do you get to eat the eggs?  Resurrection Day.  That's how you get lots of eggs on Easter.  Here's more about Lent.

Second, the "first Sunday after the full moon following the vernal equinox" also has nothing to do with serving a pagan goddess.  It has to do with the date of Easter in relation to Passover.  As the early church became disconnected from Judaism, they needed to be able to mark the date of the Resurrection (which happened on the Sunday after Passover) without having to rely on the Jewish priests for the date of Passover every year.

Passover is set for the 14th day of the 1st month of the Hebrew calendar.  Months on the Hebrew calendar begin with the new moon and are 28 or 29 days long, depending on the lunar cycle.  The full moon occurs half way through the month (on the 14th).  The spring equinox is in the first month.  That's how the date is set for the first Sunday after the full moon after the spring equinox.  (That's the simple way to explain it.  If you want to know all the complexities, study the computus.)

While I'm on the subject, I'd like to address a few other accusations against Christians concerning paganism.

Accusation: Crosses were used in ancient pagan worship.  Christians who set up crosses in their churches are following after these pagan practices. (more here)
Truth: Jesus Christ was crucified on a cross.  If you are upset about that, take up your objection with God and tell Him Jesus should have died some other way.

Accusation: Sunday was used by pagans to worship the Sun-god.  Christians who go to church on Sunday are really taking part in pagan Sun-god worship.
Truth: Jesus rose from the dead on a Sunday.  If you are upset about that, take up your objection with God and tell Him that Jesus should have picked another day to rise from the dead.

Accusation: Pagans worshiped the Sun-god, and the sun rises in the east.  Christians who hold sunrise services facing to the east on Easter Sunday morning, are really worshiping the Sun-god.
Truth: The women discovered the empty tomb at sunrise on Sunday morning.  If you are upset about that, take up your objection with God and tell Him that the empty tomb should have been discovered at some other time of day.  You can also tell Him that He should make the sun rise from some other direction on Resurrection Day morning.

Think it's silly to approach God with these objections?  Of course it is.  Likewise, it is silly to accuse Christians of paganism simply because you see some surface similarities.

I think you'll like these two articles by Ralph Woodrow:
Christmas, Easter, and the Cross
Did Sunday Worship Come from Paganism?

You might remember that Ralph Woodrow wrote the book Babylon Mystery Religion which taught that many Christian practices originated from paganism.  Then he realized the research was flawed and he was wrong.  He pulled the book from publication and wrote The Babylon Connection? to correct his errors and set the record straight.  Read more about it here.

I pray you have a blessed celebration of the Resurrection of our Lord Jesus and that all our loved ones who are involved in the WMSCOG will soon see the truth and return wholeheartedly to fellowship with their families.  I also pray that the pastors and leaders of the WMSCOG will be strong enough and noble enough and humble enough to speak out about the errors and seek the truth.  And finally, I pray that Zahng Gil-Jah and Kim Joo-Cheol themselves will seek forgiveness from the true God and turn from the path they have chosen.

World Mission Society Church of God Behavior -- Love and Hate

When you first meet people from the World Mission Society Church of God, you might remark at how friendly, sincere, happy, and loving they are.  Indeed, many that I have met are genuinely nice and caring and have a deep and sincere desire to know God.  Why do these same nice people show such extreme animosity toward those who disagree with them?

This has been my experience.  Has it been yours also?  When I ask questions (either too many or too serious), no matter how friendly or sincerely caring my intent, I am met with hostility and insults.  Why, when Jesus said we should love even our enemies (Matt. 5:43-47)?

At first I thought it was simply a failure on their part, individually.  I try, but I am not always perfect at responding to confrontation either.  Or maybe they are like those who purposely disregard what the Bible teaches about love, even though claiming to be Christians.  But it happens so often, and they claim to obey everything the Bible teaches.  What's going wrong here?  The problem is in the teachings of the WMSCOG.

The WMSCOG teaches that complete obedience is required for salvation, and by that they mean complete obedience to the WMSCOG's teachings and Biblical interpretation.

So what does the WMSCOG teach about those who disagree with them?

"God awakens us to the existence of Jerusalem our Heavenly Mother, but the devil our enemy who slanders the truth is covering the glory of God by telling a lie that God the Mother does not exist."  (from Do Not Call Anything Impure That God Has Made Clean)

They teach that those who don't believe in "Mother God" are spreading lies and slander from the devil--listening to them is listening to the devil.  It's very sad that they won't even consider that what they think is a lie is actually verifiable truth.

"The devil is our enemy because he has become the enemy of Elohim-especially God our Mother.  The serpent [the devil] is a perpetual enemy of the woman. The woman, our Mother, leads us into life, but the serpent [the devil] tries to lead us into death. From the beginning there was enmity between them, and to the very end of the age the enmity will continue. He constantly hinders the truth about Mother through various tricks. To prevent us from knowing Mother who gives us life, he denies the Biblical records of Elohim working together by every tricky word and scheme. Thus, he tries his utmost to swallow our souls and lead us into death.  The more the devil hinders us, the more we should be alert and self-controlled, so that we may resist the devil with the correct knowledge of God....  The dragon, the ancient serpent called the devil, is mobilizing numerous people like the sand on the seashore, so-called Christians, to oppose Mother and us who follow Her (Rev 12:17)."  (from The Elohim Gods)

They teach that anyone who is against "Mother" (Zahng Gil-Jah) is a servant of the enemy Satan, and that any argument that sounds convincing is one of the devil's tricks to lead them to death.  Doesn't that sound like the kind of logic a deceiver would use to avoid being exposed?

"The Bible says that the spirit that does not acknowledge God can come in the flesh is the spirit of the antichrist, and warns that we must not accept it....  Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is from Satan....  If anyone denies God's incarnation, he is not a Christian but the one controlled by the spirit of the antichrist."  (from Christianity is a Religion That Believes in Incarnation of God)

They teach that it's the antichrist who doesn't believe in Ahnsahnghong is God in the flesh.  In fact, they teach that anyone who speaks against the WMSCOG in any way is a servant of Satan...

"Then, why do Satan's servants masquerade as servants of righteousness? They do that for the only one purpose of leading people, even God's chosen ones, to hell by deceiving them. ...we should diligently preach the gospel of truth to the people, enlightening them to know the real identity of Satan and his servants who hinder the gospel of God and devour men's souls.  They deceive people into believing that what God's people keep or celebrate is not truth....  What does the Bible say about Satan's servants who blaspheme against God and His people? It says that God scoffs at them and He will break them with an iron rod and dash them to pieces like pottery."  (from Hindrance of Satan and Victory of God)

Back to the main question--why do we see such animosity from our loved ones when we are only trying to help them?  Because they are taught that Satan is using us to try to take them away from the "truth."  Their anger towards us is their anger towards Satan.

The important lesson for us here is to understand why this is happening.  That understanding may help us to avoid responding with equal animosity.

As for the logic of this teaching, I can only tell our WMSCOG friends this...
Be careful!  Satan is a skillful deceiver.  Don't fall for his schemes.  Don't just call these claims about the WMSCOG lies and ignore them.  Don't just listen to your leaders' explanations.  Check it out for yourself.  Think for yourself.

By the way, for those of us who wonder why our loved ones can't seem to see a problem that looks perfectly clear to us, maybe it's because they are also being told...
"We, too, should completely follow what God has taught and instructed us to do, as the children of God, instead of having a faith based on common sense." (from Do Not Call Anything Impure That God Has Made Clean)

If you like allegories, read "The Last Battle" by C.S. Lewis.  It's the final book in the Chronicles of Narnia and gives a good example of how deception and mind control are used to lead people to worship a false Christ.

What the WMSCOG Requires for Salvation (Preaching is Vital)

If you have a loved one who's a member of the World Mission Society Church of God, you might wonder:
Why do they spend so much time at church?
Why do they do so much preaching?
Why do they try so hard to do the will of God (as the WMSCOG interprets it)?
Why do they give so much money to the church?
Because they are taught that they will only enter heaven if they are obedient.  If they are lacking in perfect obedience, then they believe they are at risk of losing their salvation, and that's a serious fear.

There are numerous verses showing us that our salvation comes only by the grace of God.  It is God's gift to us (grace) and not something we can earn (by our works).
"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God" -- Eph. 2:8.
"Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation. However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness." -- Rom. 4:4-5

Knowing that the World Mission Society Church of God places such a high emphasis on obeying all the commandments of God, I have often wondered what they think of God's amazing grace.

In talking with the WMSCOG, they do acknowledge that salvation is by God's grace.  And occasionally, I can find written statements like this:

As ministers of the new covenant, we are like the baton, and God is the Conductor who holds us and accomplishes everything for our salvation....  Therefore, we should continuously give glory and praise to God for blessing us with salvation. We were sinners who couldn't save ourselves, to say nothing of others....  It is not by our works that we are saved and bear fruit....  And we should praise God the mighty Creator who made the universe and everything in it and saved us by His grace.  (from Sing Praise to God)

However, when I consider the rest of what the WMSCOG teaches, it becomes clear that their idea of grace, and my idea of grace (as a Christian) are vastly different.

When I examine what the Bible teaches about God's grace, I see that I cannot earn my way into heaven.  It's God Himself who has blessed me with salvation by His grace.  I have it already, and nothing I do can add to it or earn it.  Though I should try to live in a way that pleases God, my failure at perfection does not affect my salvation.  Salvation is given first, then good works follow.

I'm reminded of an analogy I once heard about our efforts to "help" God "pay" for our salvation.  It's like being presented with a gift of a luxury automobile worth $1,000,000.  When your benefactor pays for the car, you thank him for the gift, but say, "No, no.  Please let me help you pay for that.  I have a few quarters in my pocket...."  And he says, "No.  I know you could never afford this, that's why it's a special gift.  Don't cheapen it by trying to help pay with your quarters."

On the other hand, when I read and hear what the WMSCOG teaches about God's grace, it's more like this.  God has given you the opportunity to be saved.  God, by His grace, has made salvation available.  As long as you show you are worthy by obeying ALL God's commands (and don't forget about believing in "Heavenly Mother" too), you may receive God's gift of salvation and enter heaven.  Salvation is available, but obedience gets it for you.

Using the same car analogy, we might picture our benefactor purchasing the car for us, but we are not allowed to actually receive the gift until we've shown him that we can save up $1,000,000 in our bank account to prove that we are worthy of it.

If you have a loved one in the WMSCOG, then you've likely already seen their striving to be worthy of that salvation.  But just in case you wonder if that's what they are really being taught, I'll leave you with quotes from the WMSCOG themselves.  There are a great many, so I'll try to control myself and not list them all, but I want you to see just how much they emphasize this.   (And you are free to look up the sources and check the context for yourself.)

---

"However, only those who fully obey God's word can be said to truly believe in God....  If one defers doing the will of God, he is detestable and disobedient and unable to escape destruction." (from A Hesitating Faith and an Entrusting Faith)

---

"No one can be perfect without obedience....  Salvation is based on obedience....  Salvation is impossible apart from obedience." (from According to Your Word)

---

"We must keep in mind that we do not belong to God when we fail to wholeheartedly follow His teachings."  (from Become a Greater Vessel)

---

"Washing feet [at Passover] might seem insignificant, but actually it is an important ceremony established by God for our salvation....  Only he who does not slight the least of God's words is worthy of being chosen by God."  (from God's Chosen Ones)

---

"If one speaks thankful words, he will be one step closer to heaven; if he utters grumbling words, he will be one step closer to hell."  (from Learn to Be Content)

---

"If we obey God's word, we will go to heaven, our eternal home. If we don't, we will be punished in hell."  (from Let Us Know the Love of God)

---

"Those who do not keep the Sabbath cannot acquire the citizenship of heaven....  Jesus will turn His face away from them, saying, '...Do you know the reason why I have not granted you heavenly citizenship? Have you ever kept the Sabbath holy?' ... It is a qualification for the citizenship of heaven to celebrate the Passover....  He opened the way to the forgiveness of sins through the Passover of the new covenant....  Here is one more necessary condition for the heavenly citizenship-knowing God's name and celebrating God's feasts such as the Sabbath and the Passover."  (from Let's Acquire the Citizenship of Heaven)

---

"When our Master comes back and settles accounts with us, we should all please and satisfy Him as ministers of the new covenant, saying, 'We have gained ten more talents by leading many souls to heaven.' Then He will say, 'Well done! You are worthy of My sacrifice.'"  (from Like Christ)

---

"If we do realize that we are grave sinners, we shall serve others through our life. That is the way to expiate [atone for] our sins....  Never give up the opportunity of preaching which is God's sacred command and the way to receive the forgiveness of sins."  (from Lord!  I Am a Sinful Man!)

---

"Obedience is a necessary qualification to enter heaven. God, who is righteous and just, is ready to fulfill the gospel work when our obedience is complete....  We must obey everything that God has commanded us, even the least thing.  God told us, "Be joyful always," and "Be united in love for one another." We have to obey these words, too....  When we forsake our own thoughts and submit joyfully to God's will, we can complete our salvation....  The 144,000 are the people who fully obey the word of God with joy and thanksgiving."  (from One Man's Obedience and One Man's Disobedience)

---

"I believe that you, all the people of Zion, will have no regrets when you go back to heaven and confidently say that you have made every effort to preach the gospel. I hope all of you will live a life without regret, completely obeying God's will and saving all people around the world, as well as your family, relatives and neighbors. Then we will all be greatly loved and complimented by our Heavenly Father and Mother." (from Regret for Things That We Have Not Done)

---

"However, we cannot acquire eternal life without laboring for it; the crown of eternal life cannot be given to us without effort."  (from Remain Faithful to God Until the End)

---

"When we remove all the impurities of our soul, we will receive spiritual blessings from heaven and become worthy to return to our heavenly home....  As the children of God, we must not only keep all of God's commandments but also purge away all our dross, in order that we may enter the kingdom of heaven. [dross = 'the evil and impurities of our soul,' 'everything that God does not proclaim as holy'] ... No one can be a spiritual being in the kingdom of God unless he is purified from the impurities of this world."  (from Remove the Dross from the Silver)

---

"Now, we need to examine ourselves to see if we have faithfully tried to bear such beautiful fruit of enlightenment every moment since we were called by God....  If we have born no fruit unto God for many years, we are not worthy of His call. [fruit = a new convert] ...  Haven't you awakened enough souls to be worthy of God's call yet? Don't worry. You can start now."  (from Role of one person)

---

"In other words, there is no salvation, no eternal life, for those who do not observe the feasts."  (from Salvation is Given to Those Who Celebrate the Feasts)

---

"If we disobey even a single command of God, we will end up being like Esau who gave up his birthright."  (from The Firstborn of Heaven)

---

"It is the duty of God's people to thank God always. As God gave us the command to 'remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy,' so He also gave us this command: 'Give thanks always.' ... Those who complain can never enter the kingdom of heaven."  (from The Gifts of God)

---

"In order to enter the kingdom of God, we should always pay attention to God's word and carry out His will....  There are many wills of God recorded in the Bible. It is God's will that we should keep His commandments, laws and decrees. It is also God's will for us to have a disposition and faith worthy of God's people. Above all, there is an important teaching from God, which we should practice in order to enter the glorious kingdom of God. [1 Thess. 5:15-18]  ... He who is full of complaints and is not joyful or thankful can never enter the kingdom of God. Only the person who is always joyful and thankful in the will of Father and Mother can go to the kingdom of heaven."  (from The Kingdom of Heaven We Are Going to)

---

"The Bible teaches us that no matter how eagerly we may believe in God and however passionate our faith may be, if our deeds are not good, we will never be saved....  We must obey everything God has taught us, without neglecting it, no matter how small it is."  (from The Life of a Christian)

---

"As the watchmen of the truth, let us follow God's command to save the world by leading all people to Zion where Elohim our Father and Mother dwell, who protect us from disasters through the Passover of the new covenant and give us the blessings of eternal life, so that we can repay Elohim for Their grace."  (from The Mission of Watchmen and Signs of the Present Time)

---

"What is most pleasing to God is to lead dying souls to repentance and salvation. So, if this work of salvation is not processed well, how anxious and grieved God must be!  Unless we have such a burning heart, it is proof that the Holy Spirit has left us.  Even until the end of the year, if we bear no fruit or have no will to bear fruit or don't feel anxious, we should reflect on ourselves: ‘What's wrong with me?' ... [Let's] judge if our souls are alive or dead according to whether we have borne fruit or not." [remember, "bearing fruit" = recruiting a new convert]  (from The Work of the Holy Spirit Is Fulfilled through Preaching)

---

"Only those who are spotless and blameless after Father and Mother are worthy to enter the holy city....  Unless we fully resemble God, we will be rejected by them and weep bitterly. We are to have the marks of Christ-suffering, loving heart, tireless enthusiasm for preaching the gospel of the new covenant day and night."  (from Those Who Resemble God)

---

"Considering the above verse [1 Cor. 9:16], preaching is the whole duty of us all, isn't it? Unless a watchman performs his duty, he will be killed by the enemy or punished by death according to martial law. Likewise, unless we carry out our mission of preaching, we may lose our salvation....  As Christ's workers, let's faithfully fulfill our duty as a watchman and try to save many souls by using the talents God has given us, like the Apostle Paul did, so that we can all bear much beautiful fruit and attain salvation."  (from Time to Preach)

---

"Since Jesus says we cannot see the kingdom of God unless we are born again, 'being born again' is the most urgent task for those who hope for heaven. Of course, we must obey every teaching God has given us in order to be born again, but unless we become gracious in our speech, we may fail to enter the kingdom of God....  The kingdom of God is really not a place where we can go just by spending time doing nothing. Since Jesus has clearly said that we cannot see the kingdom of God unless we are born again, we should make continuous efforts to be reborn. If you fail after trying once, please try twice, three times and more, forcefully advancing towards the kingdom of heaven. There is nothing we can't do if we try ten times or more."  (from Unless We Are Born Again)

"Mother's" Sacrifice of Flesh and Blood...and Death?

Despite the Bible's insistence that Jesus was the one and only perfect sacrifice needed to cleanse us from sin (Heb. 10:1-14), The World Mission Society Church of God claims that "Mother Jerusalem" (Zahng Gil-Ja) is continually being sacrificed to provide cleansing from sin.

This means that they believe Jesus' sacrifice wasn't enough to accomplish our forgiveness.  As a Christian, this stuns me--how can God's own sacrifice of Himself, not be enough?!

Not only that, but "Heavenly Mother" can't sacrifice herself just once, but must continually sacrifice herself twice a week.  What does that tell you about the power of the "gods" of the WMSCOG?

But now let's turn our attention to the Passover, the Last Supper.
Mark 14:22-24

And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to them and said, “Take, eat; this is My body.” Then He took the cup, and when He had given thanks He gave it to them, and they all drank from it. And He said to them, “This is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many.

Whose body was broken for us?  Whose blood was shed for us?  Whose body and blood do we remember with the bread and cup of the Lord's Supper (Passover)?  Jesus' flesh and blood.

The following quotes show that the WMSCOG claims this sacrifice of flesh and blood was "Mother's" sacrifice as well.

From God Who Has Saved Us:

We should not only rejoice in having received eternal life by eating the Passover bread and drinking the Passover wine, but in them we should find our Father and Mother giving us Their precious flesh and blood and looking upon us continually with eyes full of compassion and pity. God our Father and Mother have been sacrificed for us, like the Passover lamb. They've given us Their flesh to eat and Their blood to drink, and as the result of such a great sacrifice They have saved all of us, Their children.

From The Firstborn of Heaven:

So, in this age, God the Father and God the Mother have come as the Spirit and the Bride and have given us the blood of the covenant—the Passover, the blood of God the Father and God the Mother.

From The Meaning of the Sacrifice of the Passover:

Just as the mother saved her child with the blood flowing from her finger at the critical moment, our Father and Mother gave Their flesh to eat and Their blood to drink in order to save us....  We believe in Mother not just because the Bible testifies about Her, but because She is our heavenly Mother who gave us Her flesh to eat and Her blood to drink to save us from sin.

From The Wages of Sin Is Death:

When we eat the Passover bread, we have to remember that our Parents gave Their precious body and blood for us to eat in order to save us. When we drink the Passover wine, we have to remember that our sin was so great that it couldn't be forgiven without the precious blood of our Parents, and we should give thanks to Them for Their sacrifice.

How did "Mother Jerusalem" give her flesh to eat and her blood to drink?  Has her body been sacrificed and her blood shed as Jesus' was as the Passover Lamb (1 Cor. 5:7)?

Another big problem...
Read this quote from What Kind of God Is Your God?:

In the Bible, we have to find our Father and Mother who have loved us to the point of death; They were rejected by men, took up our infirmities, and bore our iniquities; They were even treated as sinners and died in the place of sinners.

Here we have two contradictions.
1. "Mother" has "loved us to the point of death" and "died in the place of sinners"?  She is still alive in Korea.
2. The WMSCOG teaches that "Mother" will not die at all, but will take her faithful followers directly to heaven alive with her.  Therefore, according to the WMSCOG she will not EVER "die in the place of sinners" or "love us to the point of death."

I am so thankful for the real Jesus was a powerful enough God that it only took Him one sacrifice to accomplish that payment for my sins.  He actually did die for me, and He rose again from the dead!  Ahnsahnghong is still in his grave, and one day Zahng Gil-Ja will be too, as is the destiny of all humans.  (Heb. 9:27)

"Mother's" Sacrifice ... Because One Wasn't Enough?

In Hebrews 10, the Bible tells us that Jesus is the perfect sacrifice for our sins.  His sacrifice was so perfect that it needed to be made only once to cover us all, unlike the sacrifices the priests offered on behalf of the people day after day, year after year.

Heb. 10:10,12-14

"By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all...  But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God, from that time waiting till His enemies are made His footstool. For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified."

But what does the World Mission Society Church of God say?  They teach that Jesus' sacrifice on the cross was not enough to keep us clean from sin.

This is evidenced in their sermon, "Mother's Love":

All the sacrifices in the Old Testament represent our Father who was sacrificed as an offering for sin about 2,000 years ago―and also our Mother who is sacrificing Herself to seek and save the children with devotional love for them in this age.
God has given His children the regulations of Third Day worship and the seventh-day Sabbath worship from Old Testament times. Through such regulations, Mother has purified our souls by sacrificing Herself, so that we may not be cut off from the community of God.

Maybe they mean "sacrificing" as in "suffering hardships" but not in the same sense as animal sacrifices and the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross?  And maybe this suffering of hardship is to help and teach her "children"?  No.

They quote Numbers 19:1-21 (in the same sermon) about the sacrifice of the heifer, and they continue on to say:

Every sacrifice in the Old Testament symbolizes God's sacrifice. Then, whom does the heifer represent? By whose and what sacrifice are we now cleansed on the third and seventh days?
The heifer was a sacrifice representing our Mother who's come into this earth as the Bride of the Spirit. The Israelites were cleansed through the sacrifice of a heifer. This shows that God's children are purified through the sacrifice of Mother on the third and seventh days.
Our Mother burns Herself, being sacrificed as a sin offering; through the ashes of Mother, represented as the heifer, we are cleaned from all our impurities, from all our transgressions and sins―on the third day and seventh-day Sabbath. How can we imagine and describe in words our Mother's pain, sacrifice and love?

Keep reading and see that they are clearly talking about "Mother" (Zahng Gil-Ja) being sacrificed for the sins of her "children":

Through the fact that our Mother is continually getting sacrificed on the Third and Sabbath days, we must know how many sins we have committed.
Some may simply think that they are forgiven because they believe God. However, we must know there is God's great sacrifice and love beyond description in the forgiveness of our sins. By God's wounds we are healed; the punishment that has brought us peace is upon God. Through such a sacrifice by God, we are forgiven. We should realize the love of our Father and Mother and give thanks to Them through the Third Day and Sabbath worships.
Without putting on Mother's love, none of us can enter the kingdom of heaven; we are expelled from heaven, and we can never enter by ourselves.
By the sacrifice of Mother, we are purified. Mother is pierced for our transgressions. By Her wounds we are healed and at peace.

This is in direct contradiction to Hebrews 10:14.  Here it is again in the NIV:
"For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy."

Not only that, but if "Mother is continually getting sacrificed on the Third and Sabbath days" for sins to purify her "children," then she is comparable to the repeated sacrifices offered in the Old Testament.  And what does the Bible say about those?

Hebrews 10:1-2

"The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. Otherwise, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins."

What kind of "God" has to keep sacrificing herself over and over again?  Hebrews 10 says once is enough.

Public Relations Campaign? -- Responding to WMSCOG comments

Here's another comment from a World Mission Society Church of God member.  This one was sharing links to their activities on Christmas Day, 2011.  I have not removed or changed anything in this comment.

January 29, 2012, 4:40 AM, Anonymous said...

I HAVE ALREADY COME! (NEW YORK ZION)

Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=nueTjBJ2jnc

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PNnREnl8Ee0

Hello, Anonymous, and thanks for sharing the link.  I notice there are lots of videos and articles popping up lately promoting the WMSCOG.

Some are about their acts of community service.  They have begun a nine week community service campaign, so I expect we are going to be seeing a lot more soon.  Is it a good thing to help people?  Of course.  Is it impressive to see such an organized campaign?  Yes.  I don't mean to diminish any of the good work that they are doing, but...

I notice one of the people commenting says, "No other church can do like this in the world!"  Are you not aware of even a little of what other churches and organizations do around the world?  For your benefit, I'll direct you to a few activities: in Tennessee, in Alabama, in North Carolina, in California, in Fiji, and in India.  I know of a great many Christian community service projects that never get reported in the news or filmed for youtube and advertised all over--they are simply done. 

I still wonder if the WMSCOG does community service mainly to help people, or mainly to get publicity and thanks?  I don't mean to sound cynical, because I'm sure many of the individual members do want to help people, but regarding the leadership and organization in general, I think it's a fair question.

I wonder how many of these nice things they do, but do NOT film themselves or call up the news to have it reported about?  Will they report about every one of their activities during this nine week campaign?  What proportion of these activities are done "in secret" (Matt. 6:1-4)?

There are also videos showing their "I Have Already Come" message, such as this one from Atlanta.  (I feel kind of sorry for the people in the parade that look like they are being overshadowed by the WMSCOG group.  I hope they did this in a respectful way.)

Maybe they've reconsidered how public they want that 'new name' known?  But I wonder... will I stop hearing stories of people being baptized before they learn of the name Ahnsahnghong, and of people being given mysterious answers when they ask about the woman in the pictures ("Mother")?  Will they be straight forward now with people they are 'evangelizing' about what organization they are from and what they actually believe?

I HAVE ALREADY COME! I HAVE ALREADY COME! I HAVE ALREADY COME!

WE LOVE AHNSAHNGHONG NIM! WE LOVE AHNSAHNGHONG NIM! WE LOVE AHNSAHNGHONG NIM!

WE LOVE OMONI! WE LOVE OMONI! WE LOVE OMONI!

When you shout this at people, how do you let them know exactly what you are talking about?

Do you tell them what "Ahn Sahng Hong Nim" means?  Do you tell them what "Omoni" means?  Or do they have to wait and study, study, study with you until you tell them?

Why don't you use the actual name of "Mother"?  Is her name less important?

NEW JERUSALEM, NEW JERUSALEM
JERUSALEM, JERUSALEM, NEW JERUSALEM
HER BRIGHTNESS
HER GREAT SALVATION
HAS APPEARED TO US
IN THE EYES OF ALL NATIONS
OUR MOTHER SHINES HER GLORY TO ALL
ALL THE WORLD SEE HER GREAT MIGHTY WORKS
FROM ENDS OF THE EARTH IN THE EAST
THE WAY OF LIFE, HAS BEEN OPENED
FROM ENDS OF THE EARTH IN THE EAST
THE SHOUTING OF ANGELS IS HEARD
GOD ALMIGHTY HEAVEN’S MOTHER REIGNS
IN ZION, IN ZION, WITH AUTHORITY
SHOUT TO THE WORLD! THE WORLD IS FREED
FROM THE CHAIN OF SIN AND DEATH FOREVERMORE
OUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS
THEY ARE NOW REDEEMED!
NOW LET’S GO, GO TO THE WORLD!
GO CROSSING OCEANS TO ALL NATIONS
WHERE OUR BROTHERS, SISTERS ARE
TO THE PEOPLES, TO THE NATIONS
LET’S GO TO THE WORLD
NOW LET’S GO, GO TO THE WORLD
GO CROSSING OCEANS TO ALL THE NATIONS
WHERE OUR BROTHERS, SISTERS ARE
TO THE PEOPLES, TO THE NATIONS
LET’S GO TO THE WORLD
TO THE PEOPLES, TO THE NATIONS
LET’S GO TO THE WORLD!!!

WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

Thanks for sharing the words, because it was awfully hard for me to catch them all with the background noise.

Just in case you are wondering if other churches have done this to spread their message too--yes, and they are just as impressive.  It does look kind of exciting and makes me want to get involved too.  Check these out:
Second Baptist Church in Houston
The Catholic Church in Paris
A church in Massachusetts
A Lutheran church in Minnesota

I think it's healthy for everyone, no matter your church and faith, to periodically look around and see what's going on in other churches and faiths.  You might be encouraged, or surprised, or inspired, or humbled....

In summary, yes, it's impressive that the WMSCOG organized such a 'flash mob' and that they perform community service.  Are they the only ones who do this?  No.  With the large number of new videos and articles promoting the WMSCOG, it does make me wonder if they are purposely trying to build their image with a public relations campaign.

Just one more thing.  In the videos, the WMSCOG members shout out "We love you!" over and over.  Do you really mean that?  Because from my experience, except for my sister, any kind of love stopped and became animosity when I asked too many difficult questions.

Do you remember to follow Jesus' commands to love even your enemy (Matthew 5:43-46)?
I am praying for you.

Studying, Family, and Lies -- Responding to WMSCOG comments

I'm continuing to answer comments sent in recently from World Mission Society Church of God members.  This one wanted me to study more and to know that they aren't a cult...

(I have only removed the location from this original comment--no other words--but I have fixed any spelling errors to help those needing to use the online translator.)

January 19, 2012, 1:07 AM, Wendi said...

I am a mother in Canada. Nearly all my family attends the Church of God. There are so so many misrepresentations in this blog. I understand that in the freedom to speak freely people can say some very vile and hurtful things. Many evil things have been done in the name of Christianity. History teaches us this.

Hello, Wendi.  I'm glad you wrote.  Yes, freedom of speech does include the freedom to speak harshly.  I've seen rude language come from all sides.  I myself have endured many horrible, insulting comments from WMSCOG members.  That is too bad.  We should all be respectful even if we disagree, and that's what I try to do.

About "misrepresentations"-- if you believe I have misrepresented scientific or historical facts, you should know that I do painstaking research for all my articles and document my sources so you can check these things for yourself.

If you believe I have misrepresented WMSCOG doctrine, you should know that what I write about has been explained to me through personal discussions with members and through official church documents.  If you believe the WMSCOG teaches something different, then I'm left to wonder why they would be so inconsistent in their doctrine.

If you believe I have misrepresented the behavior of the members, you should know that I write about the personal experiences of myself and my friends and family.  Perhaps your experience has been different.  I have noticed that, in general, members are much nicer to people who agree with them than they are with those who disagree or ask serious questions.

It would be more helpful if you would please give specific examples of the misrepresentations you are talking about.  I would be glad to clear them up or make corrections as needed.

This is a good church. But you need to hear more than a couple of lessons to fully make up your mind. Do you go to school and take one or two courses to become a doctor or teacher? No. If you truly want to know the truth, you must seek it - and the Church of God can give you those answers if you have an open heart and mind enough to give them a fair chance to do so. 

How many lessons would make for a "fair chance"?
No matter how much my friends or I have studied, we are continually told that we haven't studied enough, that if we only studied more then we would see.

What would you say to a Scientologist (for example), who kept telling you, "If you would only study more with us, it would make sense and you'd see we are teaching the truth"?

If something is false, no amount of studying can make it true.
My mind is open but not so open that my brains fall out (as the saying goes).

We are not a cult. Cults try to take you away from your family. Our church WANTS you to stay in your family, and love them to show Gods love to them, but people always have their own agendas. 

From the experiences of myself and my friends, the WMSCOG only wants you to stay close with your family if they do not object to their teachings.  We've seen our family members distance themselves, sometimes speaking mean and hateful words to us who are only trying to help, and sometimes to the point of removing themselves from the family.

How are we supposed to believe that the church wants the members to stay in their family when we see our loved ones refuse to join us for even the most important family events of weddings and funerals?  Or when we see a member threaten to divorce a questioning spouse, or a son/daughter stop communicating with their unbelieving parents?

I don't know whose agenda you are talking about, but if you'd really like me to believe that the WMSCOG does not break up families, then I will need to stop seeing and hearing bad examples like those I've mentioned, and start hearing (and seeing) more real life examples that what you say is true.

(Do you hear that, WMSCOG leaders?  Why don't you encourage your members to restore and maintain good relationships with their families, and to thoughtfully answer their concerns instead of avoiding them?)

Don't you know that what is in your heart will eventually come out your mouth (or in this case through your fingers in print)? Pray for truth to God! But then have the grace to hear it without prejudging first. Truth will remain, lies will always come out. Wendi, [location removed]

I hope you also will have the grace to read my articles here without prejudging first.

It's funny you mention "truth will remain, lies will come out." 
The WMSCOG believes lying for a 'good' cause is ok.  They call it a 'righteous lie.'  The thing is, who decides which situations are ok for lies and which are not?  Have you ever found anywhere in the Bible where Jesus said lying was acceptable?

Do you know, the WMSCOG taught that Ahnsahnghong and Zahng Gil-Jah did not have earthly spouses or natural children of their own.  What do they say about that now?

You are correct.  The truth will stand, and lies will eventually come out.

You seem like a sincerely nice person, Wendi.  I pray that you will be able to see the truth and understand that my intentions here are good.

Second Coming Christ and Traditions-- Responding to WMSCOG comments

I'm continuing to answer comments sent in recently from World Mission Society Church of God members.  This one focused on Ahnsahnghong as the second coming Christ and also touched on church traditions.

(I have not removed any words from the original comment, but I have fixed spelling errors to help anyone needing to use the online translator.)

January 17, 2012, 7:07 AM, Anonymous said...

I think that anyone can argue just about anything if they really wanted too. but when you think about all the traditions that most churches keep are never based on the bible. 

Thank you, Anonymous, for taking the time to write.  I appreciate hearing your perspective.

Do you have the tradition of celebrating your birthday with a cake and birthday candles and presents and a party?  What purpose does such a celebration serve?  Does it matter to you where that tradition came from?

Different traditions serve different purposes, of course.  The purpose of the traditions that churches keep is to help people connect with and understand God.

A friend of mine told me about a mission trip she took.  One of the 'traditions' (as you might call it) of the Christians in that area was that the Bible must not touch the ground.  They treated their Bibles such that they considered it disrespectful for it to be laid on the floor.

I can't think of a verse in the Bible that commanded that, can you?  So this tradition is not based on the Bible.  But does the tradition have value?  Yes, of course.

Purim and Hanukkah are celebrations that were not commanded by God.  The people chose to honor God and the memory of something He did by establishing these traditions.  Is that wrong?  No.  Even Jesus kept Hanukkah (John 10:22).

How can these churches keep Christmas and Sunday worship which is a fact in history that it was made to worship the sun God. 

Christmas and Sunday worship were made to honor Jesus, not the sun god.  I'll go into more detail in a future post.

When you read the bible Christ said he would come back a 2nd time and by him the one who restores all the truth we can recognize him as God but people have a fixed idea that God would never come in the flesh. But God is our Father, think about all you would do to save your children if you knew they were heading for danger. 

Where in the Bible does it say that Jesus will need to return to "restore truth"?  The WMSCOG gives the impression that Jesus failed at His first attempt because it didn't last.  Was Jesus a failure?  Of course not.

I know of two verses the WMSCOG uses to try to prove that the truth needs to be "restored."
Luke 18:8 ...when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?
The WMSCOG says this means that there will be no faith on the earth, but that's not what it says.  It says, "Will He find faith?"  They assume the answer to be no, that there will be no faith at all.

This is like the mom who leaves her children for a little while and says, "When I come back will I find you doing your chores?"  She does not expect a 'no' answer.  She expects a 'yes,' even if it's only some of the children.

The other verse is Hebrews 9:28 ...To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.
Christ's second coming will not be to "restore truth" by bring salvation from sin again.  The word for "salvation" here has to do with deliverance, survival, and safety.  It is also used in Luke 1:71, Acts 27:34, and Philippians 1:19.  So you see it is a different sense of salvation.

Jesus came 2000 years ago and at that time everybody knew God as Jehovah but the reason he came was to establish the new covenant by keeping Passover with bread and wine instead of lamb sacrifice as in old testament. 

The reason Jesus came was to satisfy our debt for our sin by becoming the perfect sacrifice, the Passover Lamb so that death (eternal, spiritual death) would pass over us.  The Passover and Jesus' fulfillment of it is filled with wonderful symbolism.  This is a good book about it.

Did you know that Jesus didn't keep Passover "with bread and wine instead of lamb."  The Jews had bread and wine with their Passover lamb as part of the Seder meal.  The disciples prepared the Passover (Mark 14:16) and they ate the meal (Luke 22:20, notice "after supper").

God suffered in [un]imaginable pain and promised us life thru the passover. After his death at his first coming this Passover was abolished. Passover is the way to eternal life because we can have God's flesh and blood just as we have our physical parents' DNA proving we a children of God. Then how could we have eternal life if the way was blocked. 

First, there have been people keeping the Passover throughout history.  It never "completely disappeared from the world" as the WMSCOG claims.

Second, if the way to eternal life was truly blocked, then "the gates of Hades" prevailed against the Church, which would deny Jesus' words in Matthew 16:18.

God said he had to come a second time just as in his first coming. Jesus was a very common name and he was persecuted by his people and eventually sacrificed by his people. it is the same now Christ ahn sahng hong came and restored the truth and it's not that people world mission society just follow a random person just because. Just as his first coming the disciples recognized him because he fulfilled prophecy as messiah. it is the same now and sooner or later this truth will come to light. 

Jesus will return in the same manner He left, not in the same way He came (Acts 1:11).

Was Ahnsahnghong "sacrificed by his people"?  I remember being told that he died of a brain aneurysm.

And please don't use the it's-the-same-now-as-2000-years-ago argument.  Anyone can claim to be the second coming of Christ and use that argument saying, "You don't believe me, and you are persecuting me.  It was the same with Jesus."

Maybe David Koresh was the second coming Christ?  (Yes, I'm being sarcastic here.)  After all, he had a common name, was persecuted, and even killed.  And I'm sure he would have told you that he fulfilled prophecy too.

And the reason we are so persistent when we preach is because we want people to be saved and we have an eager mind and heart just as our parents did coming here. 

I understand that persistence.  When you sincerely believe something, it comes out in the way you live.  If you sincerely believe in Ahnsahnghong, then I would expect you to preach about him.  And I do believe that you sincerely want the best for people.

That's why I'm here too.  I sincerely care for you and my sister and all the others in the WMSCOG, and that's why I'm so persistent in trying to show you that "Father Ahnsahnghong" and "Mother Jerusalem" do not deserve your devotion and worship.